Women in Consulting – Building a Thriving Career (2025)

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Transcription:

0:05

Welcome back to another episode of Strategy Simplified.

In today's special episode, you're going to get to hear an intimate discussion with six leaders at top consulting firms.

We're going to share the honest truth about what it's like to work as a woman in consulting and what it takes to build a great career.

0:26

No BS, just the real raw truth.

Thanks to Bain and Company, Bates White, Capco, Clarkson Consulting, Clearview HealthCare Partners and Putnam for making this an epic episode.

Make sure to visit the link in the show notes to connect with these firms and to learn about job opportunities.

0:47

By the way, if you represent a consulting firm and you're looking to build your brand awareness and talent pipeline, reach out today to learn about opportunities to help build your pipeline through custom event and podcast collaborations with management consultants.

1:04

We'd love to hear from you.

The e-mail is [email protected].

All right, let's get into the episode.

Welcome everyone to Women in Consulting.

We are really excited to have some esteemed panelists on the call today.

1:20

We're going to share their perspective, their experience that you're going to be impressed, delighted, moved by the conversation that we have in the call today.

And so just to kick us off, I'm going to do a quick roll call for each of our folks, for each of the panelists.

1:36

We would just love to begin to get to know you.

If you could please introduce yourself, the firm that you work for and any specialty areas that you're working in inside the firm.

And then one reason to kick off is that you think women should consider a career in consulting.

In addition, the question that always comes up in the at about 700 times is whether or not your firm hires international candidates.

1:58

And it doesn't matter at all what the answer is.

It just matters that there is an answer so that people know when they are trying to recruit from an international perspective.

So we'll begin with Bain and company.

Jackie, welcome to the panel.

Great.

Thank you so much and nice to meet you all virtually through this format.

2:16

My name is Jackie Flanagan and I'm a partner at Bain and Company.

First, let me briefly introduce Bain.

So Bain and Company is the leading Global Management consulting firm advising executives on a broad range of strategy related topics.

And the only other thing I'll share is our mission.

2:33

Our mission is to help our clients create such high levels of value that together we set new standards of excellence in our respective industries.

And I'm incredibly proud to have many stories that align with that mission.

And so about me.

I've been at Bain for nearly a decade now and a partner for the last nearly four years.

2:53

I actually come to Bain as also a non traditional background.

I'm a scientist by training.

I have a PhD in biophysics from Hopkins Med.

I chose Bain as a happy accident and I started by exploring a broad range of industries and topics before zeroing in on life sciences.

3:12

So I spend all of my time now in pharma R&D helping bring new molecules to market for a broad range of patients and diseases.

Outside of that, at Bain, I'm extremely passionate day-to-day about mentoring a broad range of amazing women in all different 10 years and roles in our firms.

3:30

And finally, I'll share that I am a mom of two little ones.

I have an 18 month old and a three-year old, so about an 18 month gap there.

And I'm really loving the kind of work life balance I have now.

That maybe was my reason for why consulting is right for women.

3:47

I actually think there's a very unique way to strike a balance between your personal and professional life and still do amazing things related to the mission I.

Shared which is.

Advising and leading executives on topics that are truly crucial for our industries to tackle.

4:03

And so, you know, happy to share more in that as the dialogue goes on.

Thank you, Jackie.

Welcome for everybody on the call who doesn't know I started my career in vain and I share the enthusiasm for, for what I learned about consulting and and the superpower that it's been in my career since then.

4:21

We're so glad to have you, really glad to have you join us.

I'm Caitlin from Bates White.

Welcome.

Thank you.

So hi everyone.

My name is Caitlin Roach.

I'm a manager in the finance practice at Bates White.

So Bates White is an economic consulting firm, which is distinct from management consulting and that we focus on providing expert opinions and litigation spaces.

4:42

So typically this is on issues like statistics, economics, damages calculations, and data analysis.

We are based in Washington, DC and have approximately 300 or so employees.

That's a relatively small firm, which I think has led to many opportunities to take on more leadership roles, especially early in your career.

5:04

So I've been working at Bates White for 5 1/2 years, joining the firm when I graduate from Elon University in 2019.

After completing a summer internship with the firm.

Prior to graduation, I studied international economics, finance, and math, all of which have translated directly into my career at Bates White.

5:24

So I now manage teams of both consultants and economists who have a PhD background doing complex data and statistical analysis, and I focus in the field of consumer finance, big data and discriminatory lending.

5:41

So at this stage in my career, I'm kind of involved in every stage of a case, from taking and analyzing data to writing expert reports and preparing experts for testimony, presenting results to clients.

In terms of why women should consider career and consulting, I found this career path to be very fulfilling so far because the work is both intellectually challenging and I'm constantly learning, but it's also done in a very collaborative environment.

6:09

So I really enjoyed that aspect of working on a team and the mentorship aspect of both mentoring others and receiving really great mentorship from other women at the firm.

Oh, and then the question on international candidates.

6:25

Bates White sponsors work visas for PhD candidates, but does not sponsor work visas for other candidates.

Very helpful.

Thank you.

In fact, Jackie, can I go back to you, I don't know if you answered that question.

6:40

Can you mind answering that for Baine?

Yes, at Baine we are supportive of hiring individuals who want to work in the US after school, and we sponsor visas.

Perfect.

Thank you, gorgeous.

OK, awesome.

So, Caitlin, you're part of the answer for women in consulting, but also am I going to use this right when you're sitting in class?

7:00

The answer is yes, I think, right.

I love that you said that, that it dovetails.

And there was always that question when you're sitting in a stats class and your sophomore year of college, am I going to ever use this?

So I love to hear that that's true.

What?

Welcome again to the panel.

7:16

We're so happy to have you here.

Next, we'll move on to Capco.

Chelsea, welcome.

Hi.

Thank you for having me and I'm excited to be on today's panel.

So my name is Chelsea Matthias.

I am a Partner at Capco.

Capco is the world's largest financial services only management consulting firm serving both the business and technology sectors.

7:40

We do also have an energy practice as well, but primarily we are financial services focused.

I have been at Capco for 14 years.

So you know obviously it's I've found it really rewarding from a career development perspective.

7:58

I am currently the global head of our capital markets business, which is our second largest business practice globally and I run our US portfolio as a part of our main role.

I'm also the global sponsor for our women's network internally, which is something that I'm really proud of because we've continued to grow it over the period of time where I've been at Capco, we go by the slogan be yourself at work.

8:27

I don't think it gets any more straightforward than that.

We really appreciate and we believe people are their best selves when they can bring their whole self to work and that, you know is, you know, across the board in terms of all representation in terms of international candidates, we do take international candidates at a not entry level, you know, more towards experienced level hires.

8:54

However, Capco is, as I mentioned, a global consulting firm.

So we do have offices in all of the major hubs and I would encourage, you know, applications that way.

And then why do I think women have, you know, a great opportunity in consulting?

You know, we spoke a little bit about I think in the intro about the hard skills that are required in terms of analysis and, you know, contents.

9:17

But at the heart of consulting, I believe it's truly a people LED business and a relationship business.

And women are great at relationships.

And I think that that's just, you know, one of the soft skills that could be, you know, focused in on, you know, as we have this conversation today.

9:35

I love that we can't wait to hear more about the Women's Network too.

We're really excited to understand the details of that.

Glad to hear you're here, Chelsea.

Where are you based?

I am based out of New York.

Gorgeous.

OK, that makes sense.

Wonderful.

Clarkston Latoya, welcome to the panel.

9:52

Thank you, Janerea.

I appreciate that.

My name is Latoya Lee Jones and I'm a partner with Clarkston Consulting.

I've been with Clarkston since 2003 and I tell everyone that my career consulting started with my love for pizza because in school at North Carolina A&T State University, they were doing a nympho session about consulting and they were serving pizza.

10:14

I was an industrial engineer so I had no plans to go into consulting, but I was hungry.

So I went into the info session, learned about consulting, and immediately fell in love with the opportunities that it posed.

So that's how my transition to consulting happened.

10:34

As far as Clarkston, we've been in business for over 30 years.

We help global companies with complex business challenges.

We study and analyze the global drivers and the industries we serve, which are retail, consumer products and life sciences, which is my focus.

10:50

I lead quality and compliance practice within our life sciences industry and that focus allows us to bring that knowledge, a diverse set of perspectives and very skilled consultants to the companies that we serve.

11:06

And we believe that's what defines who we are as a professional services firm, that industry focus.

We have a broad set of services around strategy, operations and implementations, consulting that we customize for our clients in those industries.

One reason is that I think that oh, the international candidates, so we don't at this time sponsor visas.

11:28

We do have a broad set of folks that work with the firm all across the US and some international stewards as well.

But at this time, we're not presently sponsoring visas.

And then the other question about the reason why I think women should consider career and consulting, I believe that there's a wide range of opportunities to get exposure to the industry.

11:52

You get hands-on practical experience finding and delivering solutions to these companies and understanding their business challenges, which is just way more than you'll ever get.

And you know, working in an industry sector, I believe and also frankly, if more women go into consulting, we have greater chances of changing that that gender diversity that you talked about before at the highest levels, at the decision making levels, at those leadership levels and then inherently having an impact on the companies that we serve as well.

12:26

I love it.

You know, Latoya, I almost became a veterinarian because they had great snacks when I went there in middle school to shadow my local veterinarian.

So I think everybody should make sure that you're including that on your, you know, post-hire surveys, right?

12:42

How was the food at the info sessions?

That's really important.

Sometimes we miss the stuff that really matters, you know?

We'll welcome you to the panel.

13:26

Clearview, Kim.

Welcome.

Awesome.

Lovely to meet everyone.

My name is Kim GOH.

I'm a partner with Clearview HealthCare Partners, a life sciences strategy consulting firm.

I got to Clearview originally.

I thought I was, you know, prior life going to be a doctor or get a PhD or something like that.

13:43

I was very focused on the sciences and thought I'll take a flyer on business.

Came to Clearview knowing very little about the business of biotech and absolutely fell in love with it 12 years ago.

Clearview.

Now we do life sciences planning and strategy.

13:58

So everything from how do I build a portfolio in a particular area to how do I bring a particular drug to market.

Most of our clients are in the biopharmaceutical manufacturing space or investors in that same area.

When I joined the firm, we were only really small, 50 people based out of Boston, now about 500 based in the US and Europe.

14:20

And I tell people now consulting comes in so many shapes and flavors and sizes and even just within my own firm, I feel like I've seen three totally distinct companies.

So happy to share some thoughts about that as we get into the panel.

In terms of how shapes experience, I found that size of company and from to one of the bigger impact factors on what my career shaped out to be.

14:41

In terms of our approach to international hiring.

We sponsor visas and like I said, we have offices both in the US and internationally.

And then why I think more women should get into consulting #1 I think probably what brought people in in some way, shape or form to this is consulting as a real rocket ship for your career.

15:01

And we need more female leaders in business in general.

And I think consulting is a great way to get there.

Consulting is also a business of people, either your client or your team.

And it's heavily, in my experience, driven on a mentorship model.

And I think women have something really interesting and different to bring in terms of mentorship style.

15:20

And there are definitely women at my firm who are seeking out female mentors because that's really what they've found works for them.

And they learn something really different from the women that they work with.

So I think there's lots of opportunity that women can tap into through consulting, but also a ton to bring to the table in our industry.

15:38

Amazing.

Thank you so much.

Three, I love the idea of three firms within a firm since you've been there.

And the fast growth for Clearview is really a testament to that.

So yeah, let's dive into that as we move into the channel.

Great.

Putnam, Last but not least.

Hi, my name is Madeline.

15:55

I'm a manager at Putnam and I'm in our New York office.

I've also worked in our San Francisco office as well and I'm originally from Boston, which is where Putnam also has an office.

And similar to some of my other Co panelists, Putnam focuses on the life sciences.

16:11

So we're a scientific and strategy focused consulting firm.

Our clients are biotechnology creators and pharmaceutical manufacturers and investment firms who are, you know, working within those areas.

16:28

I think that reward consulting is a very rewarding career path for women and you know, for, for all people, but especially women because there's not many skills that you need to come into.

16:44

But at an entry level, you really have the opportunity to learn a ton.

Even in a life science strategy focused firm like Putnam, there's not really many prereqs beyond a willingness to kind of dive in and, and interest demonstrated.

16:59

So it's a great way to learn things that you're interested in but don't have that much experience in.

And I found that consulting skills really build upon itself.

So these are skills where I feel like you're constantly progressing throughout your career and could be a great stepping stone if you ever wanted to do something else.

17:18

And also the skills that you learn in consulting help your personal life too.

You know, how do I relate to people?

How do I resolve a conflict, problem solving all those things?

And then the last question, Putnam does sponsor international visas, so we're open to hiring international candidates as well.

17:37

Amazingly, I found that sometimes people don't appreciate me bringing my consulting life into my personal life when I'm advising them on the three points for why we should go to dinner at a certain restaurant.

But I, I feel like if you have, you know, some advice on that, I would really love that through the course of the panel today.

17:55

We're, we're, we've got an amazing group.

If y'all can't, can't see how incredible these women are, I just am so excited to dive in.

I want to move now to some of the questions that both our audience helped us create and that we're getting really regularly inside industry.

This panel is happening at the beginning of 2025.

18:13

I think that we can all already note that this is likely to be a year that will be unprecedented in ways that we, you know, haven't necessarily seen before.

And there are also things that have not changed under the sun.

So I would love to just begin with a basic functional question.

18:28

What is one way that your firm specifically supports women during key life stages, such as starting a family, other personal transitions?

Perhaps you can talk a little bit about office selection as well.

And I'd like to kick this off with Cap Coke.

18:43

Chelsea, would you mind taking the lead on this one?

Sure.

Thank you.

There's a bunch of things and I'll, I'll just focus on a couple.

So as I mentioned we have a global women's network and that network is, you know, globally sponsored, but has a regional presence to focus on specific areas and specific topics that are impacting women within that country or that geographic location.

19:09

And that helps us to create custom programming, you know, for the women you know, within once again that region.

What we have also looked to create, you know, over time was a return to office plan.

So and that or return, we'll say return to work instead of return to office because now in the remote setting, returning to the office as being physically present.

19:30

This is around creating programming for individuals.

And it's not just focus for women, but focus, you know, it's, it's gender neutral for individuals who have been out of the workforce for 18 to 24 months or greater.

And we've created a program to acclimate them to come back into, you know, a working environment and an ability to support clients.

19:50

So this has been something that, you know, many different individuals have taken advantage of.

And it's also created, you know, a safer environment, I would say, or in a more comfortable environment for people to feel like they can come back in.

And then generally, we offer great benefits, you know, health as well as social benefits to be able to support women through multiple phases of, you know, their personal lives.

20:14

Love that Chelsea, can I just push on that a little bit on the return to return to office for return to work.

Why are people usually exiting the workforce and or is it the workforce or just Capco and then are they, you know, when they're coming back?

What are their two key needs that y'all are helping them facilitate?

20:32

I just would love some more specifics because that's a really.

Wonderful.

Yeah, sure.

So you know Capco as I mentioned is a financial services and energy focused consulting firm.

So I think as financial services and consulting, we're going up against two very, you know, barriers in terms of women feeling that they can come into either of those industries, right.

20:53

So, you know, we do see that women leave consulting specifically, you know, within my organization.

But I'm sure if you see research, it's just, you know, I would like more balance.

I would like to know exactly where I'm going to need to be, you know, in two months from now or two years from now.

I just would like some stability and I did love Jackie when she said, you know, her experience at Bain, you know, is actually the opposite, right?

21:17

She feels that she has great life balance, not something that we've been able to, we've been looking to strive for, you know, in terms of the fact that you, you, we will work with you to manage it because we appreciate all the value that you bring to the table.

And we think that you can continue to grow, whether it be through having children, getting married, taking care of elderly parents.

21:36

You know, there's, there's many different types of life changing events, right?

It's not just maybe the ones that we think about, you know, off the top of our heads, but we want to support through.

All of those love that.

Well, Jackie, we'll go to you next and talk a little bit about formal or informal ways that you support women during key life stages.

21:55

Yeah, happy to.

I think there are a number of different formal ways.

Let me touch on briefly and then I'd just love to share an example to bring it to life.

So we have industry leading benefits and policies that allow all babies to thrive personally and professionally and all of the standard ones you expect.

22:14

I'll highlight that in the US, our family leave is 21 weeks for all parents regardless of gender, for births, adoptions and surrogacy.

And I'm incredibly proud to work at a firm that offers that.

We also formally have our women at Bain Affinity Group, which is a tremendous global community, but also very much an office specific construct with a broad range of formal and informal programming, mentorship and support for our women throughout all life stages.

22:42

But when you asked this question, I can't help but think about the broader mentorship and apprenticeship we have in our job.

And so, for example, me personally, when I was headed into my first parental leave, I am the type of person that would have happily ran right into that brick wall serving my clients and very, very happily doing that.

23:06

And I give full credit to my office head and my regional practice leaders, to the leader of healthcare and life sciences in America, both who happen to be men, for being the ones to engage me in the conversation of what should the next few months look like and where is the right places to continue to learn and grow.

23:22

But also make sure you're feeling good about what they both said is the most important thing next for you.

And so I learned more about that work life balance and the language and dialogue that I needed and I would need on the back end of coming back from folks in the firm who could have just as easily said, yeah, run right into that brick wall.

23:41

That's great for all of us.

And so I'm humbled by that experience.

I'm incredibly grateful for it.

And I think it is something that our culture really kind of sets to be the bar that we support all our individuals in, whatever their life stages or life dynamics maybe.

23:58

Love that Jackie, were those formal or informal mentors?

I feel like sometimes people ask about mentors and it's helpful to understand what those fall.

It's a great question.

I would say each of those individuals has a formal role in my kind of work situation because our office head plays an important role and our practice leader plays an important role.

24:18

That said, over the years, they are the kind of people that I have close relationships with, so probably informally they support me maybe beyond their existing, their existing kind of formal title.

I love it.

And then did you return to work full time just because you mentioned earlier that you did?

24:38

You know I did and I have done that in both my leaves and my leaves were relatively close together as you might imagine.

I am confident that if there was a time that I wanted to explore a part time path, that it's a route that exists.

I know many of my peers and colleagues who have flexed with that, and so I'm grateful to know there's the option when I want to be my kids basketball coach.

25:02

Cuz that is a life goal.

Of mine, I just haven't had to choose that yet.

But I hope I can.

I hope they're good enough at basketball.

I love that I have no ambition.

My, my most aggressive child is my shortest like a foot, right.

25:17

And so, so, so I hope that you get your wish there.

I think I have a better chance than some other sports categories in my family.

Awesome.

In addition, I'd love to pull in Putnam.

Would you mind sharing just a little bit about your experience with how women are supported at Putnam?

25:35

Yeah, definitely.

So we have parental leave and a return to work policy.

In addition to that, we have a working parent affinity group.

But I want to talk about two other things that I think are really key or have been key to my development at Putnam as a woman and also to many other people at Putnam.

25:53

First, as we assign everyone a career advisor.

So that's someone who's a few years more senior than you at the firm.

And that person helps with your review cycles and kind of helps you set goals and navigate any, any challenges that you come across.

26:08

I've found that to be really helpful, especially it's nice once you first join a firm to be set up with someone who's a little bit more senior than you to kind of.

Learn the ropes.

In addition to that, we have hired a career coach.

So it's a third party, but they help kind of advise people at Putnam.

26:27

There's specific times where you get set up with that career coach, like if you're graduating or moving towards a certain level at the firm, but they're also available for informal connections.

And I found that really valuable because that career coach kind of left the door open in case I had any kind of questions or needed help with an acute situation, you know, cuz every woman's experiences are unique and different.

26:52

So I, I really loved that I had the ability to connect with someone who already knew me and knew Putnam really well and was able to kind of narrow in on and a kind of situation that I was being faced with specifically.

So I think Putnam does a great job of trying to figure out the formal and informal ways to help support women.

27:13

I love that.

I don't know if you're able to share a little bit more about the, the challenge or a challenge that you face that you took to either an internal or an or the external mentor.

Are you able to share a little bit more color around that?

Because I think a lot of people might resonate with, oh gosh, I, I could see that coming up in my career and I would love to know what kind of support I'd have.

27:34

Yeah, definitely.

28:41

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I'll move on to the second question now.

I'm interested in the evolution of the consulting industry as it's either grown or you could also say declined, right?

29:33

So I'm interested in your perspective, no matter what it looks like towards supporting women and an opportunity for continued growth.

So Kim, I'm going to call on you first for Clearview since you kind of already mentioned there have been 3 firms since your tenure there.

I feel like you probably have a very unique perspective on this.

29:50

How has the firm grown or or you know, fallen away potentially from supporting women and what's an opportunity for growth?

I will say.

When the three founders of our company were men.

And so part of that growth has been a dramatic expansion to the leadership team and now having more balance.

30:10

We're almost 5050 now with the leadership team of men and women.

And I would say that just culturally that had a pretty significant impact going from a small firm where everyone had a, you know, a small firm has to struggle to survive a little bit too.

So there's everyone on call.

It's a bit crazy to try to get to a more sustainable place.

30:27

And I feel like doing that has really helped support the mothers within our leadership team.

The transition into more remote work as well has dramatically changed the structure of our job.

If you're thinking about a long term career in consulting, like we used to have to be on the road constantly in a way that we don't anymore.

30:44

And that opens up a lot of freedom and, and less inequity between, you know, someone who's in a position where they can travel versus someone who's maybe a new mother, for example, who really can't travel as much.

So that's been an evolution that I'm, I'm curious of others who have seen as well.

31:00

And then within our firm, I would say that the women who have been sort of the early additions to leadership teams starting to build that balance that we've been able to achieve, spent a lot of time helping open the eyes of some of our male colleagues as to how they could support us.

So one example is in the beginning for all of our men and from our dads as well.

31:20

So, but it was very, it was very rare just when we were getting going for everyone to take full paternity leave.

So the women really spent a lot of time telling our male colleagues like, please take your full paternity because it makes it more even when you know, I want to have a child and I want to be able to take my full maternity leave.

31:38

So things like that were a big cultural win.

I would say for us, that evolved over the course of maybe going from like 50 to 150 people as we had to kind of formalize some of those elements around.

It would mean to build a culture that was more open to women.

Of that, thank you for that specific example.

31:55

See, that's really a great highlight.

Bates White, What about you?

So I've only been working and consulting for around five years.

So that's been a super long time to observe growth in the industry.

But I did think of two things that I've seen at Bates White.

I think first of all, when I joined the firm that I work in the finance practice, which is a fairly small practice, Bates White And when I joined, there were probably two or three partners, but they were all men.

32:23

And now two of the five partners are women.

So it's been really cool to see the change in leadership in the practice.

And one of those people is a really great mentor to me as well.

So I've been able to kind of see her journey a little bit closer.

32:42

So that's the first thing that came to mind is just seeing that change in leadership.

I think there's still, you know, room to grow in that area in the industry overall.

I think we need more women in leadership, but it has been cool to start seeing that happen.

32:58

And then the second thing I was thinking of touching on some things that others have mentioned is with COVID, there's just been a lot more discussion about flexible work hours and hybrid schedules.

And that's why it has been very good about being flexible, working with individual people to find a schedule that works for them.

33:19

And so we have office coordinated days, but they're very flexible.

If you need to stay home one day, if you're sick, you need to take care of a child or anything like that.

I think there's just a lot of flexibility and there's a lot of discussion about that that I didn't really see as much before COVID.

33:38

And then the only other thing is, in terms of opportunities for continued growth, I think the fields that we're typically recruiting from are still very male dominated, especially in economic consulting.

We're often recruiting PhD economists.

33:56

I think only 30% of those graduates are women.

And then in undergraduate fields as well, we're often recruiting from STEM fields.

So I think there's still an opportunity to increase the pool of candidates and to encourage more young women and girls to pursue STEM fields just to increase the pool.

34:16

Of applicants that we're getting.

I love that one of the things that we're seeing a real increase in and just in the last, you know, 36 months have been universities that want to support students doing case competitions, which really helps to tie together the practical aspects of STEM.

34:34

I think in a way that's different from working in the science fields only.

And so that's given a lot of voice inside our university communities to giving people earlier career exposure to these types of fields, which I think could make a really significant difference.

34:51

I love to hear that.

OK.

Last but not least, Clarkston, what about you?

How has it grown and supported women?

Is the pizza better than it used to be?

Right.

Tell us all the important stuff.

Pizza's definitely better.

It's so much better.

Right.

Like, for sure.

For sure.

Yeah.

35:06

No, there's a lot more of it.

I will say, you know, I, I think I'd have to echo what Kim and Caitlin mentioned.

Remote working has definitely eliminated a barrier to entry for women in that space.

I also think the rise of more networks like the global network that Chelsea leads.

35:27

We have a women's empowerment empowerment network at Clarkson as well.

I think finding those opportunities, support and come together and discuss some of these things that maybe we weren't talking about before on, you know, what it's like to be a woman in this space space and what things that we may have to do a little bit differently than our counterparts.

35:44

I also want to extrapolate on the fact that we're seeing more women in leadership, seeing examples that look like us, seeing how they're managing their careers and their work life and navigating this industry.

36:01

Having those examples is really impactful on those who want to come into this space and, and, and know that there's a way to, to go about it and that that opportunity is there for them as well because they're seeing those examples.

So the influx of, you know, our, our, our leadership team has changed drastically in the time that I've been here as well from a gender perspective.

36:23

So seeing that and knowing that I too could accomplish that as well has been very motivating to me and I know it will be to others as well.

I think we talked a little bit about this as well, but just, and I saw a glimpse come through on one of the questions in the chat about, you know, entering the industry at a later stage.

36:42

I think people should really consider that.

I love the idea of folks at the college level getting more exposure to the fact that consulting is an opportunity for them that they can go into consulting as a woman and be very successful.

But even if you're changing careers or maybe coming back into the workplace, leveraging the industry expertise that you've gained from your previous experience and bringing that to consulting is absolutely something that can be done.

37:10

And frankly, at our firm, we cherish, we, we want folks that have that industry expertise that they can apply to our clients.

So getting more accessibility and helping women understand that this is a career path that they can choose, I think is something that we can do a better job of.

I love that.

37:28

Yeah.

I mean, that was my story.

I shaved my head and travelled the world and thought I was going to work in International Development.

And then, you know, moving over to Vain was surprisingly similar to the wild world that I had found.

But yeah, finding the welcome and the support, I'm sure you can speak to that too going forward.

37:45

But the support of the consulting firms in terms of skill development was vital to me.

I didn't know that I had so many opportunities there.

Great.

Well, let's, let's move on.

We've got a quick question now.

Just one key tip for women to navigate the ups and downs of consulting work life balance, whether it's mindset or tactics.

38:03

And Madeline, I'm going to go back to you since you kind of already opened the store a little bit.

I don't know if you got a key tip that you can share with other people, but what's something that you would recommend when women are both thinking about and practically trying to navigate work, work life balance?

It's a great question.

38:19

So I think when you're working in consulting, you're going to be working with a lot of different types of people and there's certain people who you're kind of looking up to, and admiring.

And those are the people that you could really kind of lean on if you need help navigating something or if you want to know how to approach a situation.

38:40

So even if the answer to that is, you know, the person who I look up to would disagree with person X, then you could say, OK, I feel more confident that I have a different opinion than this person.

So really identify the people that you think you kind of admire the most and think you should be kind of walking in their footsteps and either think in your head, what would they do?

39:03

Or even ask them directly like I'm in the circumstance, how would you approach this?

And then you'll feel more confident heading into that situation.

Well, Kim Clearview, what is the perspective that you can share here?

1 tip.

It's an observation, but sort of a tip.

39:22

The people who I found I have the longest standing, most respectful relationships with are people who early on in my interaction with them, I said no to something.

And I think for me it was counter intuitive.

I thought the people who would value me the most are the ones who I would always say yes to always get it done.

39:39

But those with whom I asserted, you know, this is the value that I bring and I'm not going to do that for you are the ones that have actually persisted the most and who I have the most sort of reciprocal relationships with.

So that certainly helps when it comes to managing your own work life balance and figuring out where you really want to focus your own time.

39:58

I love that.

Do you say no or do you say I can see a way to get this done for you, but it's not gonna happen?

Use.

The trade off?

Totally, totally okay.

I love it.

Bates, right back to you.

What about an answer for this?

How's something a tip that you've learned about managing work life balance effectively?

40:16

I think similar to what Ken said with the setting and communicating clear boundaries sometimes, I think there are certain times where you do need to work the long hours, the deadlines coming up, and there are other times where it's not as urgent and understanding when things are urgent and when they're not and setting the boundaries sometimes.

40:32

So an example of this is like leaving your work phone at home while you're out to dinner with friends, like you don't always need to be on call.

And I think that was a hard learning experience for me.

Like earlier in my career, I felt like I always needed to be available.

But I think you can set those boundaries with people and people respect you and others.

40:52

I've noticed more junior people on my teams really respond well to that because then they realize like they're allowed to sometimes set a boundary as well.

And so then when you're asking them for things, they know it's only when it's urgent when you're asking them.

So when you're setting that example for other people, then I think that builds a better team environment as well.

41:14

Love that.

Thank you.

I'm going to move to another quick question for some of our other panelists.

Is there a special way for women to network into an interview pipeline at your firm?

So for example, if you are a woman on the outside right now thinking about looking in, are there women's groups?

41:31

Are there events?

Are there specific pipelines that you would recommend?

Baine, Jackie, I'll have you go first.

Yeah, happy to jump in and I'll, I'll be quick here given time.

I think there's a broad range of opportunities for women to network in.

I think first and foremost on your campus, you will likely find women at Bain sport events.

41:51

And so those are certainly places I would highly recommend given our Women at Bain group has pillars focused on recruiting and making connections with women during the recruiting process.

And oftentimes those relationships stay all the way through.

I had drinks tonight with someone I interviewed and she was a woman at a Business School at that time, and she's been my professional development advisor ever since.

42:13

And it's the highlight of both of our days.

We also have several exploratory recruiting programs focused on women in North America, EMEA, and AIPAC.

For the details on those, definitely encourage you to visit our website.

I think you'll find all of the information, but know that there are specific programs with regional differences that you'll find posted there.

42:33

That's awesome, Jackie.

We can get some of that information out to the audience today in our broader list as well.

So we'll coordinate with you on that.

Thank you.

How about Clarkson?

What about y'all?

A specific way for women to network in?

Yeah.

So we are very heavy on LinkedIn.

42:49

So every event that we attend, any activities that you're looking out for to learn more about Clarkson and learn more about our folks, LinkedIn is a great way to do that.

And you'll find where we're going to be and you're welcome to join us there to attend events like this is a great way.

43:07

Now you know you have an immediate connection there.

I also always tell folks to reach out to their alumni networks because you'll find a lot of the folks that you went to school with or have gone to the same school as you work in the places that you're trying to go.

So, we hire very heavily from our alumni schools.

43:26

So you leverage those networks to connect with folks and other women who are in the consulting space to, to make those inroads.

And that's certainly a way to do so.

I actually, one of my colleagues today, had an immediate connection because we both went to A&T.

43:42

And so that's a great way to make connections and find other women who are working with consulting.

I can see the slogan, right?

Come for the pizza.

Stay for the possibilities.

That's right.

That's what the events are.

I love it.

Capka.

43:58

What about you, Chelsea?

So checked everything Jackie said and checked everything Latoya said.

What I would also just, I know we're talking about networking, but at the same time, I just urge everyone to apply, like apply, apply, apply.

Because we don't often always get the candidates that we want to see in the application process because individuals, and I will say, you know, sometimes, mostly women are holding themselves back.

44:24

So it's OK to not, you know, have every single thing on your resume.

If you're interested in it, go for it 'cause you may get the call, you may not get the call, but you're never gonna know.

So the more that we have in the pipeline to actually review as applicants, you know, it feeds the pipeline for leadership, it feeds the pipeline for our teams.

44:45

Do all the things that Jackie and Latoya mentioned around networking and you know, interacting on LinkedIn and differentiating yourself.

But it also starts with a pine.

I love that.

Thank you.

In fact, Japheth, to that point, if you want to drop a link, we have a job board at management consulted.

45:04

I think that most, if not all the firms are represented there already.

But if not, when you have open opportunities, they're coming up on the job board.

But that's one way that everybody who's listening can make sure you have access.

And also if you submit your resume there, it'll be in the resume book for a number of the firm.

So that's a really great suggestion.

45:21

Just get out there, right?

Just put your resume in front of people.

Awesome.

Well, I want to move on now to some of our audience questions and I have not selected who's going to answer these.

I'd love for you to just jump in if you have something spicy to say.

And I love this first question.

It's what is the most surprising aspect of being a woman in consulting And specifically the follow up question I think is interesting.

45:42

Are there myths or stereotypes that you had that ended up being either correct or incorrect about the field?

I can jump in.

So from, as I mentioned, we're a financial services firm, we are a consulting firm and we're also a technology firm.

46:00

So you know, all of those industries are heavily male dominated from a consulting perspective.

When we're going into an investment Bank or we're going into, you know, a commercial Bank or a retail Bank and we're working with executives that a lot of the time are males.

I, I just, I'm so surprised how welcoming and how much they want women on their team.

46:21

And sometimes they're looking for the consulting firms to bring that because they haven't been successful internally in doing that.

And it's a great way for women at all levels and individuals at all levels to get access to the fast learning that everyone spoke about in the beginning.

46:38

So I don't know if it's, you know, I, you know, as a consultant, I think that being a woman is something that you can really like to drive home on and, and people would want women in their teams.

We bring a different perspective and we bring that creativity.

Thinking where this is?

46:55

Anybody else?

I want to tag on something kind of similar to what Chelsea shared.

So when I first joined Putnam, I was having a coffee chat with someone and they connected me to another woman at the firm who's in a leadership role.

I thought that was really nice.

But now I've been at Putnam for over 4 years and I'm looking back at who are my mentors, who are my advocates, and some of the biggest ones have been the men at the firm.

47:18

So I just want to share, you know, connecting to women with other women is great and often that's a great way to kind of make that initial connection, especially in a male well dominated field.

But ultimately, that's not the only place where you can get strong mentorship.

Incredible insight, right?

47:38

Well, one of the next questions, Madeline, Madeline, you're just like, you're one step ahead of me.

I'm loving this.

It's just how do you find and develop mentors and advocates?

So you mentioned you reached out to some of the men in the firm, but I don't know if they also if that was reciprocal, if they also kind of, you know, selected you, if there was a structure around that.

47:57

But for any of you at your firms, how do you find these mentors and the advocates that can help you navigate these waters?

I'm happy to jump in.

I think there's a broad range of options as you when you join, often you're assigned a formal mentor.

48:14

You'll have projects that start up where you may find people and leadership team members on your teams that you kind of jive with and you actually make that cadence start happening and they become informal mentors.

I think you can also at Bain specifically meet folks at Global Training and other events that really align with your interests and can continue that network globally.

48:36

And the last thing I'll say is there might be times in your career where the types of questions you're asking actually don't benefit from the perhaps echo Chamber of mentors that you have created that are aligned with kind of who you were in the past, you know, two or three years, but are actually your thinking, wanting to think outside the box.

48:53

And I've had no fear of cold emailing those people or asking someone for a reference to get different points of view.

And I have never heard of it.

And if anything, I've had the offer of more time and follow-ups, etcetera.

And then the last thing I'll add is I, I don't, I was surprised.

49:11

I don't know if it's typical to be surprised how much clients can end up being mentors in ways, whether women or men.

But oftentimes my female clients from growing up in the firm are still some of my closest colleagues and the ones wanting to see baby pictures, etcetera.

And they may have moved on in their careers as well.

49:28

But I think clients as both clients and then mentors as relationships evolve is a pretty incredible gift that I'm very grateful for.

I'd like to jump into two things I've done when I'm looking for mentors, I look for people who are in the roles that I wanted to be so people who I was hoping to emulate or potentially follow the same trajectory with my career.

49:53

Those are the people I reached out and sought as mentors, whether they be male or female, because I wanted to make sure that I was learning as much as I could about them, their path and their journey and seeing how I could apply that to my own.

Not necessarily trying to replicate it, but apply it to me and make sure that it was, it was going to be my journey as well.

50:12

The other thing I did, and I think it's similar.

So what you just mentioned, Jackie, was that I also thought about, you know, reaching out to those folks who I, who may be in positions of influence, who could take me to a certain place and not being afraid to do that, I guess is the key piece there.

50:31

But sometimes we look at those folks and say, oh, they don't have time or, you know, they don't want to hear from me or, you know, maybe they won't want to take me on as a mentee.

But eliminating that fear and just doing that initial reach out, you'll make some of the best connections.

You'll be surprised how much advocacy you'll get from those folks as well.

50:53

Super insightful.

I'll ask one final question.

This is about female candidates from nontraditional backgrounds.

And I'll, I'll never forget I was in a Bain women's meeting and we were sitting there and one of the women was talking about how her spouse always felt like he was more qualified than he was.

51:11

And she always felt like she was less qualified than she was.

And she was startled by the kind of gender difference of their perspectives.

So for female candidates from non traditional backgrounds, how do they position themselves in the market as a prime candidate?

And how do they know when they're on the right track?

51:34

I'm happy to speak to this.

So I first want to acknowledge that there's more progress to be made in the world of consulting and in other professional careers for women.

I think if you're coming from a non-traditional background, then the employers that you're going to want to be working with are going to be ones who are hiring you based on your potential and not what's already on your resume.

51:57

So both your potential and your interest.

So those are the things that you want at the forefront when you're interviewing.

You want to show and state directly why you think you would be successful in that role.

It doesn't need to come from past work experience.

It could be from dealing with our personal conflict or, you know, a family situation, an academic environment, and it could really, or you know, something that you've navigated on your own, any of those to really demonstrate how you can make that transferable skill.

52:24

This also echoes what Chelsea was saying.

Just apply.

Just go for it because I think, you know, if you could share that with your employer or potential employer, it's not going to work out 100% of the time.

But the people who say yes are the right people that you want to be working with.

52:43

And maybe, Madeline, just to build on what you said, because we being a healthcare company, have had a few people come out of situations where maybe they were on a totally different career path, but they encountered the healthcare system in a way that was important to them.

So whether they were diagnosed with something or they were a caregiver to someone, which not only disrupted their career path, but also sort of set them into a direction where they had a passion for the life sciences.

53:06

So as kind of an example of one of the pieces of what you said, we've had people come to our firm with the desire to have an impact in that space.

And they really focused on that as why they were coming to consulting at this point in time.

And they've come through our interview process.

They've been really fascinating people to get to know because they come at it from a very different angle.

53:23

So it doesn't have to be a professional thing that makes you different.

It can be any aspect of your life experience.

Of it well, just in the interest of time, I'll wrap up with what I think is always the most important question of the day, which is what's your piece of advice that you would leave with folks and so I'm going to just go in the reverse order from the way that we started and and let everybody jump in here before we close the panel, I just want to say thank you to all of you for your perspectives.

53:53

They could probably speak for everybody listening and saying that we could have two hours with each one of you and still not get to the bottom of the richness of your experience.

And so thank you for everything you shared with us today.

So we'll kick off with Putnam.

So Madeline, what's your piece of advice that you would give for women considering applying for or working at Thrive and consulting?

54:15

So if you're.

Looking to break into consulting or really breaking into any field that you don't already have experience in initially you're going to have what I'll call some silly questions upfront.

So I'd really encourage you to find people that you could have really low stakes conversations with about the industry.

54:31

So maybe not the, you know, a potential employer's the first person that you're going to talk to, but it's going to be your mom's, you know, hairdresser's daughter who's also in consulting.

And just having those conversations to have a little bit of practice and, and get those silly questions out.

54:48

We'll build a lot of confidence and help you do better in the interviews when you do have more of those higher stakes conversations that could be leading to a potential job.

Great suggestion.

Thanks Kim for Clearview.

I'll say in consulting, like there's situations where you're going to find you're the only woman in the Zoom or in the room or at the table.

55:10

And I think it's easy at times to fall into the trap of I'm different and a mindset shift towards what is the difference I can make has been really helpful for a lot of the women in our company just as a way to kind of encounter maybe their first client situation if maybe they're a bit nervous.

And that definitely applies to the interview process as well, sort of reorienting a little bit of that mindset.

55:30

So if that's helpful to you, thinking through what is the unique facet that I can bring as opposed to feeling a sense of separation from what it is.

Beautiful.

Thank you.

What's via?

I always tell folks to be flexible and adaptable, have a clear goal in mind for what you want your career to be, but be willing to, you know, take an unexpected route.

55:53

Take a risk to, you know, do something that you weren't planning to get there.

It's important to have that end goal and know what that end goal is.

You keep your focus, but you know, you never know what life's going to throw at you.

And being willing to take, you know, an unexpected path is going to keep you moving in a positive direction.

56:12

And I always believe that, you know, the most growth comes in the discomfort.

So being willing to be a little bit uncomfortable is going to be positive for you.

Couldn't agree more.

Awesome, Chelsea, similar to Latoya, if you have an opportunity to take it, learn from it, you know, take everything you possibly can out of it, the good, the bad.

56:36

And then you know, once again, to Latoya's point, how do you adjust?

How do you continue to move forward?

And you know, I always say being a woman is your superpower.

So if I'm not pro-women enough after this call, but that's our superpower, right?

So use it.

56:52

Use it.

I love it.

I love how you've really tied Chelsea together.

The, the, that it's so good for business to have women in right.

I, I think that you've really eliminated that.

Thank you for bringing that to the call, Bates White, Caitlin.

I think some of the best advice I've received is to write down what you learn from every person you work with.

57:13

And so you can always learn something from, from every single person, whether it's like, these are things I want to imitate or these are things that like weren't as as effective and learn from those things from every person that you work with and, and keep track of, of who you want to be at work by imitating what you see around you.

57:32

Amazing.

Last and not least, Jackie.

Great, a lot of great advice so far so all I'll add is don't caveat yourself and don't apologize unless you truly did something wrong.

Know your worth and that is all you need to be.

I love it.

57:48

Well, I can't help but add mine from a male mentor early in my career when I tried to opt out of work, he said.

The only question is not whether you've done it before, but whether you can do it.

And I think that really made me refocus on my potential and the possibility instead of my history.

58:05

And I'd really encourage a lot of you guys to to let go of your worry and your limitations and to just go for it.

Thank you all so much for your perspectives today.

Thank you to everyone who joined us live.

We're so grateful for, you know, following along, asking questions, submitting fantastic questions.

58:22

You really make the panels hear what they can be.

And we're really excited to see how consulting and women together can make a difference in 2025.

Thank you all.

Thank you.

Bye everyone.

Thank you for tuning in to another episode of Strategy Simplified.

I really hope you got a lot out of this discussion around women in Consulting.

58:42

So if you did, we'd love to get your rating, your review on whichever podcast platform you're listening on.

So go ahead and take 12 seconds, 30 seconds to leave that rating and review.

It really does help the show out.

If you have any questions, please reach out to the team at Management consultant.com.

58:59

We love helping folks break into and succeed inside management consulting and corporate strategy.

Cheers.

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