BCG Healthcare Case Interview Example

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Transcript:

0:05

You're listening to the Strategy Simplified podcast.

Welcome back to the show.

Today's episode is a great one.

It's a BCG healthcare case interview example and it's led by an ex BCGer, Ish, who is also a Management Consulted case coach.

0:21

You can work with Ish 1:1 for your interview prep coaching via the link and this has episodes, show notes that go there to learn how to book sessions, and how to purchase coaching hours.

You can book one hour or 8 hours or 20 hours.

Again, show notes for all of that.

0:37

So this case is great because it doesn't matter if you're targeting a healthcare consulting role.

All top consulting firms expect you to be familiar with healthcare.

They expect you to be familiar with all global industries of consequence, and Healthcare is certainly one of those key industries.

0:55

If you'd like to get up to speed on other key industries that firms expect you to know for case interviews, check out our Business Breakdowns segment.

We've got them released on the first and third Wednesday of each month.

For example, we did an episode on Nike, on Adobe, on Southwest Airlines and a whole lot more.

1:14

So check those out.

Go back to the podcast and I'll listen to those.

OK, let's get your pencil and paper out.

Get ready to work through the case alongside Ish and our special guest.

Let's get into the show.

Awesome.

So everybody give Akash some words of bravery and words of confidence so that he can pass this case with the flying colours.

1:40

So Akash, this is going to be a case that is a bit different from the industry that you're used to.

But if there's any questions during the case about any of the terminology that you don't understand, happy to clarify that.

So here's a case prompt for you.

1:56

So our client is Novartis.

They are one of the largest pharma companies in the world, probably heard of them and they are headquartered out of Switzerland.

They have a small business unit that runs research and development and they produce therapeutics.

2:16

In this particular case, they're focused. This business unit is focused on a rare disease, it's called retinoblastoma.

It's a rare eye cancer and it takes place in the back of your eye, so in a part of the eye called the retina.

2:34

And it affects a small number of people across the globe.

But for this particular case, we're focused on the euro.

OK.

So in the past few years, Novartis hasn't really paid attention to this business unit.

2:53

Management has given little interest in growing this business unit.

However, recently there was a new CEO appointment and he has hired you to identify ways to grow this particular business unit.

3:13

OK.

So this seems interesting for a couple of reasons that I didn't use that eye cancer Sonic goods probably but be in case we see how we can support.

So before proceeding further to validate that you're on the same page.

3:29

Our client has no actress and we have been hired by the CEO to support how we can prove this R&D business unit is focused on retina cancer with the focus geography being here.

Thank you for this.

A few clarifying questions that I would like to ask before proceeding further.

3:47

Did it have any objective streams, aspirations or timelines mainly from terms of profitability or product loan, anything?

That's all.

Yeah.

Can you be a maybe a bit more specific as to what kind of objectives you're looking for?

4:04

Since we are procuring this business unit, I would probably take more from a profitability standpoint and any timelines that we need to adjust to.

Yeah, fantastic.

So we don't have a profitability target, but we have a revenue target.

The CEO wants the revenue of this business unit to 3X in the next 4 years.

4:27

OK, that would be.

Yeah.

And currently, their revenue is about $200 million annually.

OK.

So it's a launch product, it's not something it is a bit more as of yes.

Second, I would like to understand something about how the business makes money.

4:46

Who do we sell these drugs to?

Is it as a conventional value shame where you sell it off to distributors, they sell it off to maybe claimants and so on or it's a direct BTC business?

Yeah.

So the whole value chain in pharma that you see does apply.

5:03

But for simplicity, let's consider that our end customer, which is the patient suffering from retinoblastoma, is our target.

OK.

That of the patient.

With this being said, the final thing that I would probably want to understand will be are we the only player in this market or there's a few other players as well?

5:27

Yeah, good question.

So there is growing interest in researching retinoblastoma and it's increasingly been a competitive market, particularly driven by entry of small biotechs who are innovative and exploring a lot of different therapeutics in this space.

5:45

OK.

So it's a bit more from business.

So thank you for this.

Can I have a moment to stretch in my thoughts and then I can forget to do it?

Sure.

Sounds good.

OK.

7:20

So to grow the revenues, I would specifically like to evaluate this prompt to Anders from a development standpoint and other from a diversification standpoint.

From a development standpoint, I could look into developing the product and the second could be somewhere on the market. By product development I need more than our customizations which could be from a pricing standpoint to be a bit more competitive or from features or sun related diseases that probably we can't incorporate to cure.

7:54

From a market standpoint, we can look into developing it further through organic channels as marketing that account management and better supply chains. A few inorganic channels here could be having better partnerships as in with eye clinics, hospitals and so on.

8:14

With diversification, I would normally like to look into how we can diversify, upload wooden markets.

Since Europe is a very big continent, this could be done by understanding what are some most affected areas.

Second up, identifying are there any potential players or subsidies or other schemes that even partner with and with that enter into such offerings.

8:39

So with this King said I would post up what to understand what are the customers willingness to pay and features that they reply what is our pricing to see if there's any target that we see from this angle.

8:55

And the next step would probably be to understand what were marketed or marketed to the existence and and are then for the potent fruits retention.

Yeah.

So that's a good point.

So let's just assume for this case that patients are willing to pay.

It's a rare disease.

9:11

There's a number of treatments out there, but they're willing to pay for this particular product or set of products.

Your other question was about the market.

Can you be a bit more specific as to what you'd like to look at under the market?

Yeah.

9:28

There will be two major factors that I would like to look into.

First up, in countries where we currently operate.

Second, up our current penetration trade.

This would probably give me an understanding of what is the background that we come from and if we can possibly look to penetrate further into these or would like to explore some new countries.

9:49

Yeah, that's also a good question.

Let's say that we are all over Europe right now.

We are.

We have very good penetration.

We're one of the market leaders.

So we don't see any opportunities from that front either.

OK.

So it's the do not see anything from that front leader.

10:07

I could probably think about having more maybe something from OK, so maybe he can tweak something from a pricing standpoint, since we already know most of the patients would buy since it's a real drug and 2nd up more or less the quantity cannot be increased going further.

10:33

So the only factor that probably remains here is something on a Trevor on price for truck.

So we can assume or go further into what is the package mix, How do we sell the truck for now?

Is it in a pack of 3/5 and so on.

And for how we can take a price here?

10:50

Yeah, these are all good ideas.

Let me direct you a little bit.

Let me nudge you in a different direction.

So we're not focused on any current products that are in the market.

What we're going to focus on is more on the research and develop pipeline.

11:06

So what is being developed, what is currently in clinical trials, what is being studied, that is the aspect of the value chain that we're focused on.

OK.

So if that is what we are purchasing then probably to increase revenue it could be on how we can enhance our chances of the Dreadsome pipeline to succeed the pinnacle trials and go for all the stages.

11:34

So a few things that I would like to understand here is how such a pipeline is laid out, how many phases of testing we have and our current chances of success and going for what could be done?

Fantastic.

11:49

So we have some of the data.

Can you think of other things that you need to look at in addition to the factors that you mentioned to get to our clients goal?

I could look at it from a supply and a demand perspective.

12:06

All the factors that I did say initially come from a supply perspective as in I'll be able to have a successful shot in the market.

So from a demand perspective, it could be to understand is there a demand for this?

Are people getting to buy this and is that market big enough so that you could achieve what the exponent is?

12:27

Yeah.

So let's forget about supply.

We already established that, folks, I apologize.

I meant demand.

We already established that people are willing to buy this drug.

So let's forget about demand.

12:43

Let's focus on supply solely.

So within the supply side, you mentioned approval rate or probability of success.

That's a good metric.

You mentioned a number of drugs that are in the pipeline. That's also a good metric.

Can you think of other quantitative metrics that could help you get to the client goal?

13:16

I am sorry, I'm not able to think about it anymore.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No problem.

Could you?

That's me a bit more, yeah.

Yeah, Yeah, definitely.

So one of these terms is called time to commercialization.

So let's say that if something is in development for early days, maybe they are 10 years out into the market, maybe something is in the late phase, it's maybe only one or two years time to market.

13:41

So that's another factor that you can consider.

And then the other factor is what is the maximum revenue that you can get from commercialization of this.

So in the pharma industry, there's something called peak sales, which is if the product sells well, there is a ramp up time to that.

14:05

But peak sales is often times what's used as the estimate for revenue.

OK.

So let's look at these factors.

These are all very good and I'm going to share an exhibit with you SO and I would love your thoughts on what we can do here.

14:22

Thank you.

Thank you for the exhibit.

Can I have a numerical type best for all the information rules?

Sure.

14:52

OK.

So thank you for this.

From this exhibit we more or less get the migraine size into what the drug pipeline looks like and what could be a revenue scale up by years by time to commercialization.

15:09

And the 1st that you know the drug funnel are these in months I have.

These are in the years.

OK.

These are in the years.

Yeah.

OK.

So from this, we could probably see that the timelines are a lot longer.

15:27

Second up, we can't from here estimate what could be maximum avenues within each phase where the shroud is.

And with the second table on revenue scaler, we can probably understand how much we expect the maximum revenues to be at the end of year 4 and go moving on.

15:48

So do you want me to calculate what we can perhaps think the revenue to be and see if it makes up the three times benchmark that we would like to achieve?

Sure.

And then what would be your approach to that?

OK, so I would like to do this.

16:10

OK, so my approach here will be to go and clean the steps.

The first step would be to understand how much, how much of approval rates multiplied by maximum revenue to see how many drugs do pass this second up since I know this year.

16:35

So oh wait, can I have a moment to connect these two together?

Sure.

Yeah, take your time.

17:05

A question here, we see that years of drug commercialization, I understand this to be only after Phase 3.

Is that correct?

Yes.

So this is after Phase 3 has been completed, OK.

When it's in the market, what is the time to scale up to reach maximum revenue?

17:28

OK.

And what do we mean by maximum revenue per piece?

Yeah.

So Max, so maximum revenue is yes within that phase itself.

OK.

So we would also be able to sell our drugs even though it's within B such spaces.

17:48

Yes, if it does pass that kind of the approval rate, then you would be able to, OK.

So.

18:12

OK.

So we know what could be maximum revenue at phase three.

So during the research phase, we probably do not need to go into depth because a major ramp up would occur after it's past all the pieces.

18:32

So my understanding will be to see maximum revenues that we could earn is 60% of 100 million after phase three.

Now how does it bounce up?

So in year 1, it would be 25% of the maximum and going for the 50 percent 7500.

18:51

So that would be my more or less overall approach to doing it.

Does that seem fine enough?

Yeah, let's start with, it's a good point.

Let's focus on phase two and three because if you look at research in phase one, those do not fall within the four year target.

19:09

They're 7 and five years old.

So let's ignore them.

Let's focus on the potential revenue from phase two and three.

Phase strategy simplified.

19:50

OK, so let's start with phase T here.

The time to commercialize this in two years is the maximum revenue that we could possibly see from here is $100 million in year 1.

20:06

Zeke sees the revenue scale up to Max is 25% of 100 million differently 25,000,000 and a year to get T percent of it for the team again.

So propeal pay revenue and pays that we would see from phase two could be or 75 million since that year.

20:32

And similarly for phase three, since it's a one year program, years of drug commercialization is one which would be 25% of 100 which is 25,000,000 asthma.

So total revenue and P happiness from here would be 75 for phase two drop and 25 for phase two drop.

20:55

Does that make sense?

Yeah.

So that's what you just calculated, what's the unit of that?

That is in millions of dollars.

Yes, but there is another unit to it.

Revenue scale at Gmats?

21:17

I am not sure what.

That is, that is per drug that is approved.

Right.

OK, Yes, that's per drug for a flu, yeah.

Exactly.

So now what do you have to further account this for?

How many drugs would be approved within that phase?

21:33

Correct.

Yes.

So in phase two, OK, now I get what the exhibit actually needs.

OK.

So in phase two, we have 5 drugs up to a rate of 40%, which means that two drugs would be successful in Phase 2.

21:52

So actual revenues would be two cross 75% of this.

I think that $1 million now in this TV has two drugs in five lines with an optimal rate of 60%, which more or less means or 1 drug would be up to 1.2.

22:12

Yes, let's do 1 drug because you can't split.

A drug in point to point make sense, yes, So we would be seeing $25 million, one cross 25 S total revenues from phase two would be 150 phase three will be 25 total being 175,000,000.

22:31

Now looking back into what our target was which is of three times that ready been four years with this we would still fall a lot short to what our revenue targets look to be.

OK.

So that's great.

22:48

Can you maybe brainstorm some ways in which we could fill this gap in the target?

And I have a moment to think about it too, sure.

So I can look at, so the purpose of the city further, we are more or less falling short by 225,000,000 to lead our target three times revenue.

23:12

Now to do this I can think about it from a raw angle.

The first angles will be from a drop by client perspective, maybe look into how we can have a higher successful approval rate specifically speaking for phase two.

23:32

But maybe that can help us proceed a lot further.

The second up would be to kind of understand are there any other probable perspectives that the drugs can fill up, not just for the disease that they're actually being made for, but some cross diseases that could be worthwhile looking into?

23:52

The second nature bucket that you can probably look into would be from market and account management standpoints, look into what could be a few potential levers we can play to increase our maximum revenue.

I believe this to be a function of the total number of people and the pricing.

24:12

So maybe look into further more people could adopt this.

I understand that this is a very rare disease, so that would not be a very practical way to go about it.

Maybe looking into a bit pricing, how we can price this better compared to our competitors.

24:28

So is this where you want us to go there?

Yeah, that's certainly true in some ways.

Is there anything else you can think about?

We're just trying to grow aggressively so, OK.

24:46

Here what we did see was phase two.

We calculated it from year one to year 2 and similarly for phase three, even after trying to commercialize, the drug would continue to grow and ideally I missed that point.

25:02

So maybe if I do calculate for that, we can see if it continues growing and what it could potentially appeal?

Yeah, we can.

We can certainly do that.

But let's table that for now.

Maybe qualitatively if you can think of other options or solutions.

25:23

Other options, a few other ways I could probably think about could be from a partnership standpoint to increase the number of units that he can sell.

25:40

I'll assume there seems to be a lot of competition since you talk about smaller biotech companies.

So partnering that's Redibit Eye Clinics or partnering with some doctors for some special clinical research or trials or just normal medicine could help to increase our other ways.

26:06

I could probably think about it as the further look into whether there are some governmental grants that go around any governmental schemes that discounts this and probably bid for being elected as preferred government withdrawal that could possibly be open.

26:26

Yes, that.

Are Sundays unattainable?

Great.

So the CEO is going to walk in through the door for your final recommendations.

Do you mind just giving a quick summary of what you've found throughout this case?

Yeah, sure.

26:44

So thank you for the case.

Be very hired to understand how we sent issues.

The revenue for Azure new business unit 3 times given on our analysis, it seems that we would fall short of attaining three times revenue, but could probably attain almost three times the current revenues.

27:06

A few things that we can pre install going further to attain.

So if your meaning could be first step from better approval rates, second up could be majorly from a market standpoint which could be playing with partnerships, something along with joint wrenches could possibly help.

27:24

And finally on hiking up or playing with the Pisces Davis with this instead of the address that we should probably be aware of.

Approvals are not something that we can possibly control.

It is something that depends on how the drug would react to all patients per seat.

27:46

So we should always be ready to see whether the drugs do not succeed at all.

The second up could be the risk of capital being stuck if we are going into developing our markets and account management perspectives.

The third could be from a regulatory standpoint, since these are very fair diseases, I assume there to be a lot more regulatory pressures for companies operating there.

28:11

With that being said, I would like to thank you.

Awesome.

Congrats Akash, everyone.

I want to see some virtual applause for Akash.

It takes a great deal of courage to do this in front of a live audience.

So yeah, Akash, you're done.

28:29

Before I go into feedback, do you want to do some, maybe a quick self feedback or your thoughts on how you did in this case?

Sure.

So to be very honest, I am very interested in this field of healthcare, so I did not know a lot of terms.

28:50

Now to speak from the structural standpoint, I feel the structure could have it a bit more customized to mimic how medical health works.

The second up I would say is from the exhibit.

29:08

I would say that I failed to understand the exhibit a lot better and that led to a lot of back and forth calculations and conversations.

Maybe I should have asked what it means upfront and that, but I'm forced to help going further.

29:26

Yep, Yeah, awesome.

So let me give my feedback right now.

So I'll start from the beginning.

I think you did a fantastic job given your lack of knowledge of how the pharma value chain works, I think you did fantastic in that regard.

29:42

I do want to give you feedback on various aspects of the case.

So first of all, in the beginning when you summarized the prompt, it was great.

You gave a good synthesis which I like to hear instead of just repeating back the prompt.

29:58

A lot of folks that I see through my coaching and what I've seen through my interviewing while I was at BCG is that people just repeat the prompt and instead I think a smart synthesis is what the interview is looking for.

Second is your clarifying questions.

30:17

I think they were great.

I always advise folks to ask two different types of questions.

One that is about the business objective and the second is about what is the business model.

OK.

And I think you asked questions in both of those regards.

30:34

You asked about the value chain, you asked about the competitive landscape when it comes to the business model in terms of the objective, you probably have seen that I pushed you a little bit into telling me what you're thinking about.

So I always like folks to be very hypothesis driven as in, OK, you're thinking of this objective.

30:53

Are you thinking of a financial objective?

If that's the case, what is the financial objective that you're thinking of?

And what this does for the interviewer is it gives me confidence that you're already starting to think about this problem in a very hypothesis driven manner.

31:11

OK, As for your framework, let's move on to that section now.

So you took about one minute and 45 seconds to do the framework.

It's a tad bit longer than what I would like.

Typically you recommend folks to do a 92nd framework.

31:31

And this obviously comes with more practice.

As you do more and more frameworks, you get used to it.

In terms of your framework itself, you had two buckets, one that was around development and the other one was around diversification.

31:46

I think given your lack of knowledge of the pharma industry, I think these sufficed.

But however, they were a bit generic and they didn't really take into account the nuances of the pharma industry.

So for example, in pharma, you can obviously consider things that are in development versus things that are already commercial in the market.

32:08

You can break them down in that format.

And then in terms that you have one item here on product customizations, that's not really a thing in the pharma industry.

I would say another way of saying this would be you take the same product and try it out in different indications.

32:26

Indication is the proper term for this.

So for example, the product might have been approved for retinoblastoma, but you could try this, you could expand it to other cancers as, as a, a starting point.

So that would be similar to what you think of, a customization or product features in this case.

32:49

So trying it out in related diseases in terms of the market, organic channels, inorganic channels, I think you have some good ideas around partnerships with eye clinics.

That's fantastic.

Having good account management systems, that's great as well.

33:06

This could be some of the new ones of the pharma industry that could be brought in further here.

For example, what is the patient base that I'm targeting?

Are these adult patients or these pediatric patients?

Who is the main stakeholder here?

33:22

If it's pediatric patients, it's mostly their parents.

And then what type of doctors are you targeting?

Are you targeting rare disease doctors?

Are you targeting an ophthalmologist?

So understanding the customer base you would basically be in generic terms you'd call this customer segmentation.

33:41

So understanding the customer segments very well.

And then of course, things like what is the what, what, what is the growth trends, right.

So growth trends, it could be what is the incidence of retinoblastoma per year in Europe and how is this evolving?

34:03

What has this looked like in the past 10 years?

What is the forecast for the future?

So this would tell you more around the growth trends in terms of volume per SE.

You had some good ideas around pricing, although we did not focus the case on that.

34:20

Some other things that you could focus on a bit more, I would say, is to dig deeper into the competitive landscape.

You could have looked more into what other companies are out there, what is their approval timeline like, what are the pros and cons of their drug versus our drug.

34:45

So maybe Novartis' drug has higher efficacy, better safety profile.

These are things that in the pharma industry are considered as factors.

So you could certainly include those as well.

So that's kind of what I would say as an example framework.

35:06

What I like to say is that there can be hundreds of different frameworks created for a single case.

There's no correct framework.

However, some frameworks are better than others.

So that's the way I like to think about frameworks.

So folks who are listening in and tuning in, this is just one example of a framework.

35:24

They could certainly be better frameworks created.

OK, let's go into the following part.

I think it took you some time to navigate through that.

We're not focusing on the commercial aspect as in what is currently in the market.

35:42

We're focusing more on what is in the pipeline.

But once you got there, I think you did a solid job.

It did take some time to go over the exhibit.

So let's walk through that a bit more in detail.

I know there's some audience questions over this as well.

36:01

So first thing we need to keep in mind, what is a client goal?

The client goal here is to 3X their revenue in the next 4 years.

So from just based on that research and phase one would be automatically excluded.

36:16

So then you can place your efforts into phase two and phase three.

So the first thing that I would do here is look at, OK, there is this number of drugs in the pipeline, how many of these, if the probability rates are correct, what would be the potential number of drugs that would get approved?

36:35

So you would basically take 40% and multiplied by five in this case and then 60% * 2 That's the first thing you would do.

And then you would take into account if they got approved, what is the time to commercialize.

So the drugs that are in phase two would take two years to commercialize.

36:54

So they would only be in the market for two more years to fall within that four year timeline, right.

And for phase three, it would be one year to market.

So they would be in the market for three more years.

37:11

So that's kind of how I would think about it.

And then you can start taking into account these revenue scaling.

So what is the ramp up period?

So in year 1, it would be a 25% realization off that 100 million revenue and year 2 would be 50% of that.

37:32

So that's how I would do the math.

You did it in reverse order, but you did come to that eventually you understood it.

I think part of this could have been clarified with me, the interviewer.

So anyone listening, I would always clarify.

If you don't understand what is in the table, interviewers are more than happy to clarify that for you.

37:54

Just to give a preview of the math here.

So this is all putting it together.

So the things to focus on in particular are the revenue from phase two and the revenue from phase three.

And in total, once you do all of the math, it comes out to 300 million.

38:12

I'm not sure if your math came to 300 million or had a different estimate, but that's what it would be once you did all the math together.

So collectively this would fall under the target.

The target is 3X the same 200, which is 600.

38:29

So it would be $100 million below that target.

That's what I would say.

We always urge folks to give a quantitative response.

So a quantitative response is what would be appreciated in this case.

OK.

38:47

And then I think in terms of your creative question around brainstorming, I think you had very solid ideas there.

I did like a number of those but a few more that just to add here.

I think you mentioned this briefly, but investigating this in, in other cancers, other types of rare diseases even that could be very possible international expansion beyond Europe.

39:17

So looking at the US market, the U.S. market is the most prolific for pharma.

So I would certainly look at that another way.

Rare disease drugs, again, this comes from knowledge of the industry.

So rare disease drugs cost very high and that's because it's targeting very few patients.

39:39

And so in order to recoup the research and development cost, the price of rare disease drugs tends to be high.

And so in this case, you can often think of times depending on the country you're in or, or what kind of patient advocacy groups that there are for certain rare diseases, there can be patient assistance programs and this can certainly help with higher penetration of the drug into the market.

40:08

OK.

And I think another one that you mentioned was some collaborations.

I think that was a fantastic idea as well.

Partnership and of that nature I think is great as well.

OK, So that's pretty much the feedback that I had.

40:28

Jeff, do you want to take questions from the audience at this point?

Yeah, now's a good time.

First off, thank you so much to both of you.

Akash, I know it's probably about midnight by now for you.

So I really appreciate you staying, staying up for this.

And then it's just well for your fantastic leadership and feedback here.

40:47

We've got 10 minutes left and so we're going to answer as many questions as possible.

And the best way to get your question answered is to type it in the chat.

And so I'll, I'll just pull up a couple of ones that were coming in earlier.

Number 1:00-ish is around industry focus and case interviews.

41:06

So is healthcare a healthcare case like this?

Is that something that right somebody only interviewing for like a healthcare specialist role should expect?

Or is this more something that like, you know, anybody, you know, an industry that everybody should kind of be aware of and be up to date on for case interviews?

41:25

I think the short answer to that is everyone should have a basic understanding of the most common industries once you interview for a generalist role at a company like BCG.

So that's kind of what I would say as the basic answer.

41:41

And for that there is as part of Management Consulted, we have a number of industry primers, but also our managing director, Jenny Ray and Naman, who's our CEO.

They do podcasts together on various company overviews as part of the Strategy Simplified podcast where they cover the basics of how and economics of various companies.

42:07

And from those two resources, I think you can cover a lot of the industry primers and general industry knowledge.

So I've recommended anyone who's interviewing for a generalist firm to not only get an idea of the pharma industry, but any industry, any common industry, whether it be defense or aircraft or mining or oil and gas.

42:35

Just do a basic industry primer.

It's really helpful in regards to that.

Could you give a list of industries?

I don't know if that's necessarily the most helpful thing to just give a list like start with the business breakdowns on the podcast.

42:54

There's a link here in the chat.

Yeah.

And just to chime into that, if you go into any of the major companies' websites, let's just take BCG.

If you just go to the BCG website and look at industries, you'll see a list of industries and that's a starting point for you.

43:12

Super helpful, great place to start.

All right, How much does it affect your chances if you make a calculation mistake but realize it and correct it?

Great question.

So during my time as an interviewer, it is not detrimental if you have a correct framework.

43:30

So if you set up your math equation upfront, you say that, OK, I'm going to multiply this by this, by this, by this to get to the target.

And then I'm going to add these across phase two and three.

And then I'm going to see how this relates to our target.

43:48

If you give that upfront and then you make slight errors later on depending on the interviewer.

And again, some interviewers are more generous than others, but you're more likely to have a pass on that because you have recognized your mistake, you gave a solid framework upfront, and then you have corrected it.

44:07

Here's the question about networking.

So a little bit of a shift here.

Sarah is asking what questions do I ask during networking calls?

How much should I talk about myself versus asking questions about the person I'm talking with?

Yeah, such a great question.

Always think about the person that you are talking to in their shoes as to what they want to hear and what they would like to speak about.

44:33

So of course, give an introduction to yourself, inform them as to who you are, but also be enthusiastic about what they're doing, what their experience has been like as a consultant, in that office, in that company.

What are some of the cases that they've worked on?

So be very enthusiastic about them.

44:49

People do like to talk about themselves, so ask those genuine questions.

And that's a very good networking and rapport building approach.

I love it.

Some of the questions about the next case, we do this once a month.

45:06

The next one I believe is March 4th, so coming up in a couple of weeks.

Yep, that'll be a different case, different industry, industry.

So we'd love to have you join us for that.

Are there any from James, any like general trends in pharma that that folks should kind of like to pay attention to?

45:28

Like you mentioned, having a general awareness of what's going on in an industry.

I imagine this is kind of part of that, like being aware of general big picture trends in major industries.

Yeah, I think you can certainly look them up if you want to.

But beyond the basic mechanics of the industry, I don't think you have to know or have deep knowledge about the industry.

45:52

It's not required at all.

And I would say if you just watch the news day-to-day about basic business trends, I think that should be sufficient to help you out and the rest of the context is going to be given to you during the case.

Absolutely the interviewers are on your side.

46:13

Most of them, at least Ish is.

Yeah, I think so.

Just to give you guys an in.

So interviewers are never trying to say something like, gotcha.

Like they're never trying to do that to interviewees.

We genuinely, when I was part of the interview team, generally we, we really rooted for candidates.

46:33

We want you to succeed.

And so if you can't prove yourself, then like that's going to mean you're out.

But the baseline?

Every interviewer walks in with the desire to see you succeed.

46:52

Absolutely.

And so that's a great reason why candidates work with management consults and work with coaches like Ish.

So I'll just give a shameless plug to get on Isha's calendar.

All right, we've got links in the chat where you can purchase one hour or 8 hours or 20 hours, all right, And you can talk with Katie too, to figure out which is the right fit for you for that.

47:14

But it's just got, I checked his calendar before we jumped on.

He's got a couple of sessions starting as soon as Thursday, so 2 days from now, but those are limited.

And of course, if you get interviews coming up, now's the time to do it.

47:30

All right, we got a question from YouTube.

Amazing.

Thank you so much, Michelle.

How much time is reasonable to spend building the framework?

Yeah.

So what we recommend here at Management Consulted is 90 seconds, I would say is the Max.

47:49

Of course, no one is measuring time and it's not part of the scoring, but the quicker you can do it, the better.

And this is a practice you should not stress too much. Oh my God, I'm taking like 9091 seconds instead of 90.

It's a general rule.

48:06

Beyond that, it starts feeling long.

So use that as a benchmark as you're practicing, as you're doing drills.

We at Management Consulted have a set of structuring drills where you can do a set of frameworks repeatedly, and that will help you build that kind of a muscle to do frameworks quickly and more efficiently and of course, correctly in a short amount of time.

48:31

So once you do those, you should be able to be within that 92nd time frame.

I love it.

All right, switching gears a little bit to the fit interview.

So this question, I'm just going to summarize it a little bit, paraphrase it in the fit interview.

48:52

How much do you talk about your, your PhD, right PhD research, PhD accomplishments in, in an introduction in a fit interview.

Dana J, You might be helpful if you clarify right, so we can give you a little bit of a more specific answer, but it should just say anything you want to add, you know, say that one.

49:13

Yeah.

So if you are from a pH D background then and everyone gets this question which is like walk me through your resume, tell me about it yourself.

There's some form of that question that you get initially.

And regardless of your background, you should talk about what your accomplishments are.

49:29

What what you've succeeded in.

And if it comes from your PhD, then yeah, definitely you will need to talk about it.

But be very careful.

You are not supposed to talk in scientific jargon or in ways that people cannot understand because a lot of folks will not be PhDs on the other side who are interviewing you.

49:47

So be very careful of that.

Speak in a way in which the other person can really understand your accomplishments.

That's so good ish.

That's what we help people do with a black belt and particularly with her resume edits as we help you right, reframe your experience for a business context.

50:07

So that we're, we're going to talk about your, your PhD accomplishments, your research, But in a way that, right, an eighth grader can understand and in a way that a recruiter or a consultant in any role can and any firm can like understand and figure out how, how you might be a fit for that firm.

50:26

All right, we've got one to two questions left here.

Max is asking how reasonable it is to ask for extra time in a BCG interview.

Extra time for anything in particular?

For example brainstorming questions or to digest an exhibit.

50:43

Yeah, I mean, don't abuse it, don't ask, oh, can I take 60 seconds or can I take a moment every single time you get a question?

But also, if you need time, use it.

That's going to be my answer because there's no formula for this.

50:59

Of course you're going to take time when you do your framework in the beginning, but then every subsequent time, if you see you are in a roadblock or you cannot think further, take time.

But also don't abuse it every single time.

That wraps up another episode of Strategy.

51:16

Thank you for tuning in.

Whether you're joining us from Apple or Spotify or Google or YouTube or somewhere else, we appreciate you.

We'll catch you on another episode soon.